Posted by Vendetta

I didn't say she could fix it, I just think Trump would be equally as useless.

Yup he's rich, so you'd think he'd want to benefit the rich right? He wants to reduce corporation tax and income tax for those in higher tax brackets, both of which benefit him massively.

What he is suggesting is just trickle-down economics, something that has been shown time and time again not to work.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/georgele.../#465894e52555  

Posted by John

I love how these guys are talking so much **** about Hillary. Yeah she did some things wrong, what politician hasn't, but to keep defending Trump who has no such experience as a politician.

How does having no experience as a politician make him "wrong" or worse than Clinton? Do you realize what her experience includes? It includes selling herself to special interests, being responsible for the deaths at Benghazi, and putting American security at risk for her own convenience. Can you even name one good thing she has done?

Posted by John

Who is just a business man who didn't pay taxes for 20 years is unbelievable.

No, that makes him a smart businessman. What's unbelievable is that Clinton (both of them) helped cement the laws that he's taking advantage of, and then Hillary acts like it's crazy that he's doing it. She wouldn't do it any sooner because her supporters and donors (George Soros for one, who claimed an operating loss of $2b recently) have been doing the exact same thing.

Posted by John

If we put him in office everything is going to stay the same

You realize she's been involved in this process for 26 years? And wants to effectively be a 3rd term for many of Obama's policies? What do you think is going to change? You're making this broad talking points but not actually saying anything at all. So, what's going to change?

Posted by John

Then she'll sit back and laugh.

Yeah, I bet she will.

 

Only when the rich finally give up and move their money out of America will the economic socialists realize what funds their protests.  

Posted by PigParty

http://www.forbes.com/sites/georgele.../#465894e52555

But that's exactly what Trump wants to do. Cut the taxes of the wealthy and expect the middle/lower classes to benefit, it's the definition of wealth trickling down (except it doesn't).

The article you cited states that "Higher taxes on the rich mean that those people have less wealth to invest, donate, and spend, while the government has more for its purposes.".

When reducing taxes this simply doesn't happen because it relies on the wealthy spending their extra income within the US economy when in reality there are tons of leakages that occur. The government on the other hand are capable of making investments within the economy which stimulate growth.  

Posted by Vendetta

But that's exactly what Trump wants to do. Cut the taxes of the wealthy and expect the middle/lower classes to benefit, it's the definition of wealth trickling down (except it doesn't).

The article you cited states that "Higher taxes on the rich mean that those people have less wealth to invest, donate, and spend, while the government has more for its purposes.".

When reducing taxes this simply doesn't happen because it relies on the wealthy spending their extra income within the US economy when in reality there are tons of leakages that occur. The government on the other hand are capable of making investments within the economy which stimulate growth.

You shouldn't selectively read that article.

Here's a quote from it:

In a free society, wealth doesn’t trickle down, or up, or sideways. It is earned.

What people like Obama don’t understand or won’t admit, is that people of all economic strata, and no matter their race, religion, sex, or anything else, have far more opportunities to earn in a society with a small, efficient, frugal government than they do in a society with a huge, wasteful one.

The tax cuts during the Reagan administration somewhat increased the resources of the taxpayers, while at the same time, repeal of some regulations gave them more freedom to take advantage of opportunities for gain through exchange. The result was a large increase in production and employment. Increasing wealth did not “trickle” to anyone, but the climate of freer markets enabled many Americans to earn more. Some who had previously been poor found jobs that paid well, saved money so they’d have investment capital, and then began their own businesses. Their increased incomes were a gusher, not a trickle, and it was earned.

It's funny. The very next sentence after the one you quoted from the article directly contradicts the point you were trying to make with your selective quoting.

Higher taxes on the rich mean that those people have less wealth to invest, donate, and spend, while the government has more for its purposes. The taxpayers usually are pretty careful with their own money, but politicians are notorious for squandering it.

 

Posted by PigParty

You shouldn't selectively read that article.

Here's a quote from it:


It's funny. The very next sentence after the one you quoted from the article directly contradicts the point you were trying to make with your selective quoting.

So selective quoting includes picking something out that I disagree with and arguing against it?

What he's saying is just not accurate at all. Do you think Donald Trump makes personal investments that better the economy more so than a government investment? Nope, he invests in what's best for him and not the economy so an insane amount of that money finds its way out of the economy

A pretty ridiculous amount of what Trump produces comes from outside of America, is that investing in the US? Nope, that's money leaking out of the economy.

A lot of the money from the wealthy is also invested into things that don't benefit the economy much at all, examples of these being real estate and the stock market. Or they make purchases on imports such as foreign travel, vehicles and other luxury goods that aren't produced at in the US. How do you suppose this money finds it into the hands of the less wealthy?

Just because businesses have more money doesn't mean they're going to stop maximizing profits, they're still going to outsource labor and invest in factories in countries such as China. There's very few new jobs to "earn".  

In all seriousness, trump won the debate and should be president.
Anyone that wants Hillary Clinton to win is a ****** feminist social justice warrior and only wants her to be president because she's a woman  

Posted by Albie

In all seriousness, trump won the debate and should be president.
Anyone that wants Hillary Clinton to win is a ****** feminist social justice warrior and only wants her to be president because she's a woman

I'm voting for Trump, but this type of post is the stupid **** that people quote when someone says "Trump supporter" in a negative light.  

you're all stupid for arguing about the election on a forum.

I win.  

Posted by PigParty

.

You're ******ed.

Posted by Albie

.

You're also ******ed.  

Outsourcing jobs is a completely different issue. You think if rich people are taxed more that they will then stop outsourcing jobs? As I said before, arguments on this issue are usually over-simplified. Rich people don't just but Ferraris and expensive houses. Most rich people have their own business or brand. They want to continue growing said business or brand. I know if I was raking it in and could either get taxed in America at a high rate, or I could get taxed in some other country for a lot less, I would give it to the country that's taking less of my money. One could argue that raising taxes on the rich could actually cause the US gov. to receive less tax money from the rich because they will move their money.

Also, it came off to me that you were using that quote to defend your point and building off of it because you talked about that the gov. will have to money to spend on good programs, which the article contradicted. Sorry if I misread that.

Posted by 5hift

You're ******ed.

You're also ******ed.

the fact that you said that only confirms you're ignorant & not to be taken seriously.

Posted by Fulgore

I'm voting for Trump, but this type of post is the stupid **** that people quote when someone says "Trump supporter" in a negative light.

It's from Albie. What did you expect? Just like the one shown above.  

Posted by PigParty

Outsourcing jobs is a completely different issue. You think if rich people are taxed more that they will then stop outsourcing jobs? As I said before, arguments on this issue are usually over-simplified. Rich people don't just but Ferraris and expensive houses. Most rich people have their own business or brand. They want to continue growing said business or brand. I know if I was raking it in and could either get taxed in America at a high rate, or I could get taxed in some other country for a lot less, I would give it to the country that's taking less of my money. One could argue that raising taxes on the rich could actually cause the US gov. to receive less tax money from the rich because they will move their money.

Also, it came off to me that you were using that quote to defend your point and building off of it because you talked about that the gov. will have to money to spend on good programs, which the article contradicted. Sorry if I misread that.

Yeah sorry, I'm just trying to backup the point that lowering the taxes on the rich isn't going to benefit everyone like Trump suggests. I'm saying that reduced taxes won't stop them outsourcing jobs, this means that if business want to invest in factories they will just invest in them in places such as China. This would just create jobs in China, there would be no increase in jobs in the US.

Yeah a lot of it isn't buying but investing, which also contributes very little. A lot of wealthy people invest their money in the stock market or real estate, there's no point just leaving it sitting in a bank. Again, the money is just sitting there not contributing to the economy.

It doesn't work as easily as moving your money though, if it were that easy everyone would just pay tax to the country that were offering the best rates haha. People find loopholes but these definitely need closing.  

Posted by Fulgore

It must be noted that while there is proof that climate change is real, the amount that humans contribute relative to everything else is still pretty speculative. Just food for thought.

No thats not true at all lmao. The fact that we causes this is a not being debated in the scientific community.  

Honestly I'm not in favor of lowering taxes for the rich. I just disagree to some level the reasoning that many people use for raising taxes, such as letting the gov. spend it on programs. The gov. will never have enough money. They could be given 30 trillion dollars this year and they would still find some way to use it all up within 10 years without improving the economy. I liked what Trump originally said about getting rid of the loopholes that all the wealthy use, and because of that, I was fine with lowering taxes on the rich. But it doesn't seem like Trump's actually getting rid of the loopholes. Granted, 90%+ of what Trump and Hillary Clinton both say they'll do won't end up getting done, so what they say on this issue probably doesn't even matter.  

Posted by PigParty

Honestly I'm not in favor of lowering taxes for the rich. I just disagree to some level the reasoning that many people use for raising taxes, such as letting the gov. spend it on programs. The gov. will never have enough money. They could be given 30 trillion dollars this year and they would still find some way to use it all up within 10 years without improving the economy. I liked what Trump originally said about getting rid of the loopholes that all the wealthy use, and because of that, I was fine with lowering taxes on the rich. But it doesn't seem like Trump's actually getting rid of the loopholes. Granted, 90%+ of what Trump and Hillary Clinton both say they'll do won't end up getting done, so what they say on this issue probably doesn't even matter.

I can't see either of them closing the loopholes. Everyone says they will but they seem to never get round to it, I expect it's a little more complicated than it seems.