What I see when people tell others to not discuss the topic and just pay respect


Got the meme from instagram  

Posted by Sardon

America will have to decide between economic prosperity and morality

America requires to sell arms and this war is a perfect opertunity to do so ,however it is immoral and I doubt Trump will stop to sell weapons as it makes America a lot of money even if it kills a lot of people around the world.

I can't help but believe the Republicans would be making this a huge deal if it was the Democrats that made this arms deal with Saudi Arabia.

The partisainship has ruined the political discourse. Neither side takes the other side seriously anymore, and therefore nothing gets done. Instead we just criticize each other, even though we all want the same end result.

Posted by Eugeen

What I see when people tell others to not discuss the topic and just pay respect

I don't see people say not to discuss the topic. In fact, the only good thing an incident like this causes is a discussion that hopefully leads to change. People, however, don't want others to be insensitive towards the issue.  

The fact remains that almost all terrorist attacks nowadays are committed by Muslims, I'd say 90%. Also, Christianity has been modernized and twisted so much considering there are multiple Bibles with switched up words and books added into them such as the King James Bible and the Catholic one that includes the book of Wisdom. Islam has not really been warped with since the Shia and Sunni split up, Muslims generally support the Quran to not be translated into many languages besides Arabic because it could change the words. Plus, last time I checked the countries with Christians in the majority have a secular system with the Church and State separated. Countries like Iran, Saudi Arabia, Sudan and many other Muslim countries still enforce Sharia Law which are laws stated within the Quran, which describes "the way". It's really sad that people are still this ignorant after all of these attacks.

For those who don't understand what Sharia Law is,
http://www.billionbibles.org/sharia/sharia-law.html  

I don't think there and an automatic correlation between the presence of Islam and the creation of terrorism in the Middle East. There are a lot of other factors to consider like resource scarcity, the large number of ethnic groups there to begin with, potential colonialism from western investment in procurement of the resources that do exist (i.e. oil), and general animosity between the numerous religions each claiming equal birthright due to their respective histories. A religion is a religion. The situation might have been switched where the Muslims in the west feared for their lives due to the Christians in the Middle East. There's certainly biblical passages that could feed extremism just as the ones you cite in the Quran. It's circumstantial; the roles could have easily been reversed, things just turned out the way they did. Jumping to the conclusion that Islam is the unique perpetrator seems shallow, anti-intellectual, and frankly racist. Perhaps you should dig deeper instead of just picking the low hanging fruit. Encouraging more animosity between the religions ironically seems to only further the very phenomena that make the Middle East unstable in the first place and thereby allow extremist dictators who threaten western life to arise.

Posted by Regius M.

The fact remains that almost all terrorist attacks nowadays are committed by Muslims, I'd say 90%. Also, Christianity has been modernized and twisted so much considering there are multiple Bibles with switched up words and books added into them such as the King James Bible and the Catholic one that includes the book of Wisdom. Islam has not really been warped with since the Shia and Sunni split up, Muslims generally support the Quran to not be translated into many languages besides Arabic because it could change the words. Plus, last time I checked the countries with Christians in the majority have a secular system with the Church and State separated. Countries like Iran, Saudi Arabia, Sudan and many other Muslim countries still enforce Sharia Law which are laws stated within the Quran, which describes "the way". It's really sad that people are still this ignorant after all of these attacks.

For those who don't understand what Sharia Law is,
http://www.billionbibles.org/sharia/sharia-law.html

And Christians could just as easily do this, they just happen to live in a democratic society which forbids an extremist interpretation of their religion. The enemy is not Islam but extremism. If we are fueling these attitudes of otherness then the blood is on our hands as well.  

Posted by Regius M.

The fact remains that almost all terrorist attacks nowadays are committed by Muslims, I'd say 90%. Also, Christianity has been modernized and twisted so much considering there are multiple Bibles with switched up words and books added into them such as the King James Bible and the Catholic one that includes the book of Wisdom. Islam has not really been warped with since the Shia and Sunni split up, Muslims generally support the Quran to not be translated into many languages besides Arabic because it could change the words. Plus, last time I checked the countries with Christians in the majority have a secular system with the Church and State separated. Countries like Iran, Saudi Arabia, Sudan and many other Muslim countries still enforce Sharia Law which are laws stated within the Quran, which describes "the way". It's really sad that people are still this ignorant after all of these attacks.

For those who don't understand what Sharia Law is,
http://www.billionbibles.org/sharia/sharia-law.html

is this guy serious? how does one link a bias christian website to explain shariah law lmao  

Posted by PigParty

hard-right Conservatives

? I'm not a "hard-right Conservative." I support gay marriage and I'm pro-choice. Joke's on you, buddy. I don't understand why you're still so bothered by the fact that I suggested she use her platform for something productive. If you wanna be an apologist for a religion that legally murders people within their own society in 2017, you go right ahead.  

Posted by Thallen

? I'm not a "hard-right Conservative." I support gay marriage and I'm pro-choice. Joke's on you, buddy. I don't understand why you're still so bothered by the fact that I suggested she use her platform for something productive.

What would you have her say?  

Posted by MattKan

What would you have her say?

Matt, no offense but I'm beyond talking to you ITT. You called me sexist for a reason no one can figure out, implied I'm "too old" to be criticizing someone 4 years younger than me (???), and now you're calling people "racist" for questioning Islam (which is a religion). I'll gladly get into that conversation if someone a little smarter wants to engage in it, though.  

Posted by Thallen

Matt, no offense but I'm beyond talking to you ITT. You called me sexist for a reason no one can figure out, implied I'm "too old" to be criticizing someone 4 years younger than me (???), and now you're calling people "racist" for questioning Islam. I'll gladly get into that conversation if someone a little smarter wants to engage in it, though.

Hm, well I think that'd be pretty weird for Ariana Grande to tweet out, but maybe.  

Posted by Thallen

? I'm not a "hard-right Conservative." I support gay marriage and I'm pro-choice. Joke's on you, buddy. I don't understand why you're still so bothered by the fact that I suggested she use her platform for something productive. If you wanna be an apologist for a religion that legally murders people within their own society in 2017, you go right ahead.

Mk, sorry then. The viewpoints I've seen you express in this thread anwyays fit mostly with Conservatives, and hard-right Conservatives. Not dismissing the viewpoints, just classifying not just you but many other hard-right Conservatives who have criticized Ariana Grande for her response. I don't understand why you're so bothered by her response, though. You didn't just suggest that she use her platform, you outright attacked her personally. I've never apologized for those behaviors and you know that, but your argument is weak so you have to make bull**** up to further your argument. It's a classic tool used by many that can't back up their argument, so they just attack the person they argue with.

Posted by Thallen

Matt, no offense but I'm beyond talking to you ITT. You called me sexist for a reason no one can figure out, implied I'm "too old" to be criticizing someone 4 years younger than me (???), and now you're calling people "racist" for questioning Islam (which is a religion). I'll gladly get into that conversation if someone a little smarter wants to engage in it, though.

but you called me out for being an apologist for terrorists and saying that I'm okay with and not offended at all by terrorist attacks. Come on, it's a 2 way street. This is exactly how arguments lose substance.



Someone who knew the attacker from when he was a child said he was lonely and separated from society. Is that not a detail that should be weighed when determining what caused him to committ this act? I don't see many popular Muslims that are heavily involved in their community committing these attacks. Most of them are separated from society, and have few human connections.  

I don't beleive this thread should be used to debate islam but rather grieving the victims of the attack.
if you want to fight go fly on United Airlines  

Posted by Hadi

is this guy serious? how does one link a bias christian website to explain shariah law lmao

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...Indonesia.html
https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...li-islamic-law

if Sharia Law sounds fine for you, go move somewhere where it's implemented.

I don't see any countries that are ran by the Church and stone people because of their sexuality, only country that is ran by the Church is the Vatican City and they are barely a country.

I'm not even a Christian, lmao.  

Posted by Regius M.

if Sharia Law sounds fine for you, go move somewhere where it's implemented.

I never said sharia law sounds fine to me. I'm just saying that it's incredibly stupid and unfair to tell people to understand sharia law from a bias anti-islam website run by christians. I have no idea why you're being so butthurt.  

Posted by Hadi

I never said sharia law sounds fine to me. I'm just saying that it's incredibly stupid and unfair to tell people to understand sharia law from a bias anti-islam website run by christians. I have no idea why you're being so butthurt.

Just saying it's a belief system that's messed up and most websites portray it well besides ones that are Pro-Sharia. I picked just one of the top three. It's just common knowledge that Sharia Law isn't good, lmao.  

Posted by Thallen

Ariana Grande posts

What do you think she should have done and said as a response?

For my opinion on it; I know what I feel that she should've done. I feel like she should've first posted about how badly she feels for the victims of this. I find her saying what she did was very... meh. I don't disagree with her feeling emotionally distraught, but I think she could use her platform to better support the victims and their families. She wasn't injured in this, and her first priority should be to support those who were. I don't think she has to interject herself into the political discourse yet, because she could still be processing what she feels in that regard. But she has a opportunity to use her platform, even if she abstains from the political side, she has to support those fans.

Other topic:
Islam is a religion that is extremist in nature (at the moment). While Christians and their religion also has extreme scripture, but most Christians don't follow it, obviously. Islam is different. It is used as a platform for that kind of behavior and actions, and thus needs to be viewed differently. It would be foolish to say everyone who follows Islam is that extreme, but it is undeniable that the religion is used to radicalize and is responsible for extremism. I don't believe the religion itself has to disappear, but it needs to be modernized like Christianity was.

Which is why, even as a liberal (basically a socialist) I believe that the travel ban wasn't a bad idea. I didn't like it's iteration of complete denial, but being cautious with it is a good idea. At least for a little while, till the region calms down. Either way I would like to see us defeat IS, but then get the hell out of the Middle East... We, as a nation, have overthrown enough governments and caused enough instability in the region. We are a big reason for why they are attacking us. But that's a different conversation for a different thread.