Posted by Thallen

meh, I think Heras and hearts translated well on the old Graal, but I don't see a real purpose for it in the 2014 state of the game

completing all the quests from the 2000ish era of Classic was seen as neat and an accomplishment because the community was so small and practically every single player who was committed to playing the game could and would do it, so those additional hearts were never any sort of an advantage

here, I think it'd be kind of weird and unnecessary to give players advantages like more hearts, stronger sword, faster shields because that does nothing but empower players who have played longer and put new players at an uncomfortable disadvantage

you'd surely have to limit statistics to be equal for players who queue into spars and PKing below <40 AP would show no advantage (unless you add level 2+ sword/shields) so I don't even see how additional hearts server a purpose for anything other than killing baddies

the current quest model that iClassic follows, the one where you can unlock a mask shop and unlock the looting system, that's pretty cool and more quests like that wouldn't hurt at all

+1

That and I hate quests.  

Excellent idea dusty  

Posted by Thallen

meh, I think Heras and hearts translated well on the old Graal, but I don't see a real purpose for it in the 2014 state of the game

completing all the quests from the 2000ish era of Classic was seen as neat and an accomplishment because the community was so small and practically every single player who was committed to playing the game could and would do it, so those additional hearts were never any sort of an advantage

here, I think it'd be kind of weird and unnecessary to give players advantages like more hearts, stronger sword, faster shields because that does nothing but empower players who have played longer and put new players at an uncomfortable disadvantage

you'd surely have to limit statistics to be equal for players who queue into spars and PKing below <40 AP would show no advantage (unless you add level 2+ sword/shields) so I don't even see how additional hearts server a purpose for anything other than killing baddies

the current quest model that iClassic follows, the one where you can unlock a mask shop and unlock the looting system, that's pretty cool and more quests like that wouldn't hurt at all

I think you kind of missed the entire point of my idea... none of the hearts gained will benefit you in any way in PvP. Attacks from other players will always deplete your core hearts(3 main hearts) FIRST. Baddies will deplete your additional containers first, and if they run out, start depleting your core health.

Posted by ufoburan

good question, I would assume going by Dusty's idea that you would still take the "core" damage like normal from traps that are inside towers which I would think be considered pvp areas.

Yes, since it's PvP it would deplete your core health.

Posted by ufoburan

1. How will we be able to tell which is our core heart containers and what is ones used fighting baddies?

I'm not sure yet. Either by color, or size or something like that. For example in Binding of Isaac you can get 'Soul Hearts' that are temporary(once you lose them, you can't refill them back up). They're denoted by being blue:
http://bindingofisaacguide.com/Images/Post-Images/Binding-of-Isaac-Health-1.jpg (Unsupported image host)

Posted by ufoburan

2.Would there be items to refill your lp's,and would this be effected by the AP system? Or would that be shut off as well?

Do you mean your expanded hearts? If so, yes you'd be able to refill them. Since AP revolves around PvP, I see no reason it should effect hearts that only benefit questing.

Posted by ufoburan

3. Dusty mentions making it so stuff would effect things like fighting baddies. So how if at all would that effect Holiday quests or events? So would they not do Holiday quests anymore? Would it limit holiday quests so the holiday quest wouldn't involve baddies,or be effected by the new system?

Not sure what you mean.

Posted by ufoburan

4. Would it be possible to make it so there is a system that would auto rotate things around in a dungeon after a certain period of time? That way you would be able to reuse the same dungeons,but it would never be the same. That way you still have the challenge of figuring out where things are and keeps ppl from making and using guides.

The most ideal way to approach such a thing is procedural generation. And I would LOVE to do something like that in Classic, but it would be very difficult, and pretty much all action-oriented.

Posted by ufoburan

Perhaps if magic is used they could use this as a way to purchase spells,or to pay to have your magic bar/meter refilled once depleated. Unless you decide to wait for the cool down period to end like suggested.

Magic is already implemented, and it refills itself after you use it.

Posted by Imprint

The Hera hearts on their own probably wouldn't supply a sense of progression even if they were required to complete higher difficulty quest areas. There would be no incentive to get to these more difficult dungeons if the only reward was the opportunity to try a more difficult dungeon. The idea would probable strike with a few players, but the majority wouldn't be inspired by hearts which do nothing outside of PvE. It doesn't affect the group which towers, the group which spars, nor the group who PK. Therefore, to give a sense of reward and progression there would need to be item rewards or some other gift at the end of each dungeon.
So, if there needs to be a reward at the end of each dungeon anyway, it leaves the Hera Hearts idea, while interesting, comepletely redundant and less interesting than alternative options to open paths to dungeons. It's a lot cooler to give a player diving gear and have them dive to find the entrance to the next dungeon than require them to have 4 hearts total to enter. Then, not only does the player get a tool which can be used to enter the dungeon, but it also can be used to find secrets with similar entrances in the main world. Ex: Rat, Scuba Gear.

The goal is not to have boring "prerequisites" but rather to be able to build up difficulty. Right now it is extremely hard to implement more complex/difficult areas because everyone has 3 hearts. I would never add a door that says "You must have 4 hearts to enter!" It's that I want to be able to add more difficult baddies. Right now players are able to slide by because they respawn where they die, but if dungeons are added this won't be happening. They will respawn at the beginning of the dungeon, thus this becomes a much more critical thing to avoid frustrating players.  

Even if it's not a requirement to enter, it doesn't seem enough of a motivator to reward players with decreases difficulty in dungeons.  

Posted by Imprint

Even if it's not a requirement to enter, it doesn't seem enough of a motivator to reward players with decreases difficulty in dungeons.

You would not only gain a heart from a dungeon, of course there will be items. However, I can't balance ALL dungeons and new content around all players having just 3 hearts. It becomes stale and boring as I have to dumb it all down so I don't overwhelm players. You have to remember that a good portion of the people playing are not skilled gamers.

Larger dungeons will reward items. However, there is a finite amount of possible items that can be rewarded as there are only so many ideas, so for smaller things(like hidden secrets and such) it becomes boring to reward just a hat, or other cosmetic things.

This is not a "THIS WILL REPLACE ALL REWARDS EVER" idea. This is a, "What else can we offer on top of new hats, shops and so on?[/i]  

I imagine everyone will agree that we are all fond of new opportunities to make money. Even if it isn't a whole lot, there is less reason to worry about running out of activities or how to stay engaged while creating financial stability.  

This would be great!  

Just something on the side, referring back to the treasure maps thread idea I made a while ago, perhaps you could introduce a quest with the reward being the tools to read these maps? such as a compass, sextant etc. so that is possibly something.

On the other hand, the Hera hearts idea was a great suggestion, but ofc there should be tougher baddies to kill to 'balance' this, which itself is a reward also (the ability to kill tougher more skilled baddies would create enjoyment for players!)  

AP balances additional hearts!!!  

I'm not sure if this would be a good idea, players could easily get confused but thats only small it just sounds way too big. The hearts are fine for now in my opinion.  

Well, there's also tears of Hera mentioned in the game that you could possibly trade with the gnomes for something.  

Posted by Livid

I'm not sure if this would be a good idea, players could easily get confused but thats only small it just sounds way too big. The hearts are fine for now in my opinion.

But they're not. Like I said, it's hard to develop new content without dumbing it down for players who can only take a few hits before dying.

The question is not if there needs to be a change, but the best way to do it.  

Adding to making content interesting, perhaps new baddies can have special moves or something of the sort? For example, a "bartender" baddy has a 10% chance to throw beer in your face instead of a normal attack. Upon the special, you would get the eggnog animation on your screen.

Your idea sounds pretty cool, and I feel would shift classic to more of an adventure game (which I'd prefer).  

Posted by Fire Surge

Adding to making content interesting, perhaps new baddies can have special moves or something of the sort? For example, a "bartender" baddy has a 10% chance to throw beer in your face instead of a normal attack. Upon the special, you would get the eggnog animation on your screen.

Your idea sounds pretty cool, and I feel would shift classic to more of an adventure game (which I'd prefer).

Same words as this walrus. Even though I don't play Classic (and Graal entirely), I would love to see how the results of this stick around.  

I would love it if they exchanged Classic for Zodiac although it's not exactly the same kind of thing.