Theres been an explosion at a concert in Manchester, England. 19 Dead so far, unsure whether it was terror related but it is highly likely that it was. The concert was an Ariana Grande concert and Manchester is now on lockdown.

And before anyone asks - Ariana Grande is ok.

I'm betting $20 on "religion of peace".
But hey that's just part of multiculturalism sweetie :^)

even Trump got whipped into shape from his ignorance (at least for a day):
http://www.mediaite.com/tv/terrorist...-saudi-arabia/

anyways, now 22 are dead. it's just sad

Ripperoni

22 dead (including children and teens) 59 injured, it was a suicide bomber so it was most likely an Islamic attack.

Suspect is a White Male who simultaneously voted for Trump and in favor of Brexit

Grande's response thus far is trash, she spammed Twitter about how she is "crying" and "terrified" after Trump won the election but all she had to say after this is:
http://i.imgur.com/lgKIL4a.png

She needs to be using her platform to help do something about this

She also canceled the remainder of her tour in Europe (meaning the terrorists have effectively won) - for someone so brave in the face of "Islamophobia," she's very quick to run like a coward back to the country that she claims to hate so much

reset the clock

what do you expect her to do?? I don't see how her platform could help do something about this - at least without getting political just hours after people lost their lives. And even then, all she can do is talk to her fans/followers, and that's not going to solve the problem of terrorism. The attack just happened last night. We don't even know anywhere near all of the facts. Tweets about Trump were political, this is not political. If anything, props to her for not saying more without knowing the whole situation yet.

Yeah, props to her for making a Tumblr-esque tweet for million retweets… We won't hold it against her that she said before that she wished all of her fans would die, but it's fair to hold that type of thing against someone like Trump (who wants to protect her against these incidents)

What I expect is that she not cancel her tour like a coward (already failed that one) and for her to keep her mouth shut from now on when it comes to political matters regarding keeping these people out of our (or any) country - either that, or when the inevitable occurs and it's confirmed that it was a radical Islamic terrorist, it'd be nice to see her condemn it and hold the ideology accountable

Yeah this f**king bit*h better stop giving her opinions and go f**king let herself get bomb'd

riperoni
http://i.imgur.com/BjeY4ye.png

A teen celebrity should be held to the same standard as the President of the United States? I just researched the fans dying thing since I don't keep up with hollywood gossip, and apparently it's a rumor that she denied saying (not on camera or anything and was only reported by again, hollywood gossip websites, even though they may often be right with their reporting). Even if it's true, she's a young girl who said something stupid. I've said tons of **** that I'd never dream of saying anymore. I do know of when she licked a donut and said she hates America, and she apologized for it, which is not something Donald Trump has done for his many reckless statements. Again, I go back to the fact that you're holding a teenage celebrity to the same standard as the President of the United States, and you're holding the President of the United States to the same standard as a teenage girl.

I would also like to point out that you view it very one-sided. What you think helps the situation is not what others might think helps it. For instance, you said she shouldn't criticize the political ideas to keep "these people" out of the country, but the criticism isn't of keeping terrorists out, rather the banning of everyone from certain areas (or of certain religious beliefs) in order to keep out a select few. In some people's view (yes, usually Liberals, just as Conservatives have the views of Thallen), the rhetoric from Trump to ban millions of innocent people because of their religion only helps ISIS and other terrorist groups because it potentially paints the picture for people of other countries that America hates Islam and that Islam needs to unite with the terrorist groups to fight the hate/oppression from America.

But yea, props to President Trump for calling the bomber out as a "loser". We won't hold it against him that he said Islam hates us, along with....
http://www.politico.com/magazine/sto...s-cycle-214420

Honestly it's sad that you're already criticizing Ariana Grande for a simple, sympathetic response to a tragedy that she was caught in the middle of herself. Have some respect.

I don't at all, but the thing is that in Western culture she probably is more influential than the president (sadly enough). Her side controls the message. When you are famous enough to be followed by 46M people on social media, you need to realize that you have a responsibility if you decide to go into political matters. We're at a point where I think liberals would literally be fine with impeaching Trump if it meant Ariana Grande took his position. That's not even hyperbole.

What's your solution? Do you not think that such a thing would drastically lower the rate at which terrorist attacks occur? At the expense of what? People can't enter the country? It's our country, so? Don't you think they need some sort of reformation when it comes to their religion? Killing gays and making women dress in full-body carpets isn't exactly compatible with our way of life.

Liberalism is the disease that's going to allow ISIS to become perpetually stronger. Had they instead targeted some right-wing entertainer who has spoken up in support of Trump or Brexit, it would empower liberal idiots even more and their embrace of this dangerous ideology would become even greater, that's the saddest part. We're in a downward spiral due to the position of Western media. They control the message that everyone sees, and their message is strongly in support of a culture that hates gays, oppresses women, and wishes death on apostates.

This attack will literally change nothing except Ariana Grande's follower count on Twitter, because (as London mayor himself said) terrorism is now "part and parcel" of our way of life due to how embarrassingly ****ed we are. People like Grande are the loudest and (sadly) most influential in the face of opposing views, but the most cowardly and silent when it gets thrown in their face.

They are losers. Why does this offend you? They're pathetic. They're the lowest and most pathetic forms of life out there, they're terrorists. Are you trying to imply that we should be afraid to say this about them? You want everyone to pretend they're nice so that they won't attack us. "Stop calling them names or they'll kill us!" Are you kidding right now?

You seem like a huge apologist when it comes to this. Can you not even condemn Islam on the basis that they murder gays and harshly discriminate against women? Flat out, ISIS is evil and Islam itself is regressive. Neither of them are good, and I'd be quite happy with experiencing neither of them in the US.

But her platform doesn't penetrate the type of people that are involved in some way with terrorism. She reaches out to fans, many of which are teenagers, most of which live in Western countries. She's more influential on a local, teen scale, but Trump is more influential when it comes to countries like Saudia Arabia, Lybia, Iraq, Iran, etc. and people of all faiths, especially Islam. She also isn't in a position to create political change through law, Trump is. So her political comments hold less water than Trump's do, because she's a celebrity, and Trump is the President.


At what cost, though? Yes, the ban Trump proposed would undoubtedly decrease the chance of terrorist attacks on America. It might also create some homegrown attacks from people who get radicalized and are triggered by the ban to commit terrorist attacks, but overall it will decrease them. Most of our prisons are filled by African Americans, so can we just treat all African Americans differently than all other races and not allow only African Americans to not posess guns or other drastic measures? It's about the cost versus the benefit. As an Independent, I think that the cost outweighs the benefit when it comes to the proposed ban. This might be taken out of context or may be poorly worded by myself, but I can't think of a good way to say this: A few people's lives does not outweigh the principals of an entire population, when the lives will have been lost from those who don't share the peoples' principals.

I'm an Independent, which I only point out (again) to note that I don't think this type of rhetoric helps the conversation. Arguing opposing viewpoints is great, but when it just becomes an attack on Liberals or when Liberals just make it an attack on Conservatives, all support for an argument is lost.

It doesn't offend me. I wouldn't have even brought it up before you criticized Ariana Grande's reponse. My point was that it was simply a response to a terrorist attack. Trump's verbal response isn't going to do anything to stop the attack, and he has an enourmous platform. My point was that you shouldn't expect even more from a young celebrity singer.

Damn, you really inferred a lot from me just because I brought up Trump's response. Of course terrorists are the pathetic scum of the Earth. No one's pretending they're nice, not even Liberals. Again, the argument is lost when it just becomes partisain attacks. No one pretends they're nice or that we should be afraid to condemn them. The issue is with overgeneralizing the problem - which Trump didn't even do by the way.

You keep making personal attacks and inferring things from me out of no where. The problem of overgeneralizing is present in your statement. Hell yes, many Islamic countries treat women poorly. Every religion did in the past; most have progressed with the times. Islam surely will, but it will be painful and slow for them. Many Muslims actually leave those countries for Western countries because of their treatment. Every Muslim I know believes in equality and treats everyone equal. Again, Islam itself isn't the problem, it's the countries, the leaders, and the ideologies they spread through their population which is mostly Muslim. I just think it's a very narrow perspective to overgeneralize the entire religion as bad because of the propoganda being fed to mostly Conservatives. Hell, even America doesn't treat people all equally and 50 years ago we most certainly didn't. Yes, currently it's on a different level of inequality, but inequality nonetheless. Doesn't mean all of America is bad.

This is the 'bad apples' problem that pisses me off with the overgeneralization of police. One police officer discriminates against blacks, and some people with very narrow viewpoints end up painting all police as racist.

This goes without saying, but like I said, she has a responsibility and should be held accountable if she interjects herself into certain issues. What is she "so sorry" for anyway? That fans died at her concert, right? Well, it surely isn't her fault. Whose fault is it? It's the fault of radical Islamic terrorists, but she refuses to acknowledge that. Apologizing for the tragedy is correct and it's the PC thing to do, but that's not doing anything other than generating a buzz on social media. Imagine if she called on her fans to be more accepting of measures to prevent these things from happening.

Don't treat it as if I'm bothered that she apologized or by what she said, but there are a lot of additional things she could say but never will. She chose to try to influence millions of people not to vote for a candidate, but she won't try to influence people to come together and help fix the problem that caused these deaths at her show.

The cost isn't trivial, it's clear - at the cost of Muslims from countries with certain threat levels being temporarily unable to enter our country.

Do you or do you not think Islam, as a religion, is regressive when compared to Western culture? There are two possible answers, and both of them go against your argument:

1. Yes, in which case it makes no sense that you're complaining about the president of a sovereign nation wanting to temporarily ban migrants from high-threat countries controlled by the religion
2. No, in which case I don't think you know very much about Islam

There's not much left to say after that. Islam is dangerous and incompatible with the West. ISIS flourishes because it's so easy to manipulate an already-regressive religion and shape it into some murderous and hateful idealogy. You're telling me I shouldn't criticize someone's response to an Islamic terror attack for having no real substance, and I'm telling you that the same person voted against the obvious, short-term solution to fixing this problem that just got 20+ of her fans killed.