Tileset REVAMP
 

Im basically making this thread because this sub forum is kinda dead. But I honestly think a whole new tileset with a different concept and everything is kinda unnecessary, that might be just be me. But I honestly think we should just simply revamp the tileset. Like add some color, and make it have more of the modern graal shading style. Cause I think the concept of the sky world and everything is really cool and unique, it just needs to have some pizazz.

Add some colour? Kinda vague there.
Modern Graal shading style? What?
Futuristic makes me think of clean, flawless, advanced.

Oops sorry I should have been a bit more specific. I basically just meant give it the modern gfx style like classic. Y'know like the type of shading they have and the colors they use, even era has it going with the style a bit of ol west.

Tldr
I personally just like their style of gfx and I think it should be added

Yo even though you're graphics staff that doesn't mean you have to act oblivious to what he's trying to say. That tileset is terrible. It's far from looking "advanced" and what you're probably picturing as utopian. It's a combination of two disgusting, and completely different styled, kinds of tiles.

You could only expect that style in off topic items (holiday shop, event shop etc)
Anything else and it'll look out of time.

By the way, we have a new tileset. Kind of waste to scrap it and revamp the current one, isn't it?

Not if it never gets used

You make it sound like it's not.
Who / what is your source?

By the way, saying Zone never gets anything done isn't valid.

I disagree. Zone's tileset is ugly and limited. I want a completely new aspect in Zone. Zone should emphasize planet exploration with various biomes, and the central 'hub' that would act as skyworld would be a spaceship. Zone has the coolest theme with the most potential of any Graal server. It's just not being taken advantage of. Parts of the new tileset look pretty badass and everything I want in Zone's tileset. That **** needs to get done, though. No excuses, especially when the artist is being paid.

This tileset has been in the works for a long ass time now. It started with Tashkin and is still unfinished and unreleased. It's valid to criticize the tileset project for never being used considering its been so long and hasn't seen the light of day yet.

Unfinished?

since a few weeks ago, yes. Just because levels staff are working with it doesn't mean its finished. Unless the major amount of work I was informed was needed was suddenly completed in a fraction of the time it took to get as far as it was a few weeks ago. If it was finished, it would be released soon after. The map design should already be planned out. The only reason I would understand that a finished tileset wouldn't be released is if other activities/jobs that required scripting were to go along with the Zone remake, in which case the tileset will not be released for a long time to come. Going back to people complaining that it will never be released.

Time

A tileset is a large undertaking and it's difficult to maintain a consistent, refined style. If multiple artists are working on this over time on a hobbyist basis, the end result won't be too great.

In this case, it would be far better to commission a new tileset by a professional with a clear and comprehensive brief.

A professional will deliver a good tileset within a deadline and in a timely fashion.

The only other option is for a volunteer to work on this in a professional manner, with a spec, milestones and deliverables. In this case, an agile, iterative project management model would work best.

In either case, you need a project plan before anything can be expected to happen. This is the type of project that is doomed to take literally forever otherwise.

Perhaps Zone in general would benefit with this kind of approach to deliver some large scale changes that everyone here has rightfully identified. Without, you'll only get short term projects that are a rush to complete I.e seasonal releases.

There is supposively a tileset there to use, 1pretty much done. use it. cba hearing more excuses.

I think we should see it first because it's either a load of hot air or not much better, which again would be as good as hot air.

Ask chelt to show again, graalians censor it -because apparently leaked-although we would see anyway if ever released lmao so should be allowed for viewing.

what jwd said... ive been missing a project management structure/approach on graal projects entirely...

rarely is anything ever coordinated

iclassic seems to be having an okayish structure though


people really need a structured environment, especially artists, else its all chaos and stuff doesnt get done

needs an eye on human resource management too though so it doesnt feel too much like a factory and also a special confidential person or team for the staffs to relay their problems to or for motivational purposes

100% agree.

The other thing good structure brings: priorities.

Is the tileset the number one problem facing Zone right now? Will a new tileset make the game more fun?

Personally I don't think so. Graal classic isn't the nicest looking - the tileset, afaik, nearly 20 years old. Era by and large isn't the nicest looking either. Those games do well.

People play games to have fun, not to look at tiles. A nice, consistent style helps big time but it isn't going to fix gameplay. In fact, you waste time on that at the expense of fixing gameplay, you have lost precious time needed to reverse decline. There is only so far you can go - there is a point of no return.

It's a paid artist outside of Zone. The biggest problem probably is that Zone went through 4 different managers during the time of the artist making the tileset. Each manager wanting something different.

I agree 100% but I think the tileset is the top priority because that's all anyone can do to help Zone right now. I don't think unixmad is investing coders in Zone to make the needed activities and improvements (Zone has so many bugs it's unbelievable). Coders have been on and off in Zone and a lot of the projects I have heard about them working on have never seen the light of day yet and to my knowledge were scrapped when the next manager of the long list of managers came in and took over.

Even issues that don't require professional coding aren't even addressed. Trading is a major issue. That was "addressed" recently but it was hardly enough. Zone's whole economy is garbage and it ranges from weapon prices to jobs to missions and events. None of it has been fixed, or even attempted to be fixed.

That then means the project did not have a plan. It wouldn't have happened if there was a clear scope, which outlines exactly what's needed including look and feel with examples, plus an outline of deliverables by milestones.

If the scope changes, the contractor must be paid more for their time.

It's simply not fair to put an external contractor through that where they have to redo their work because the project manager changes and their opinion along with it.

The 4th manager should have received the work exactly scoped out by the 1st manager.

Basic, textbook project management failure.

I understand your reasoning but then the top priority really is to find the resources that are currently missing to fix the biggest problems.

A new tileset won't fix those problems. It would suck for everybody to waste the effort like that.

The number one priority is to get the resources (I.E programmers, designers) to fix the problems you have identified. Small wins that do actually improve things will help build momentum towards tackling the bigger problems, as well as providing leverage to make a genuine and convincing business case for unixmad to make the investment.

The reason why unixmad isn't investing is because after all this time it isn't an investment worth making. After all, the tileset botch job is a clear example of why he shouldn't make further investment and rightfully so.

There's another thing: Zone is a business. An online game is a business. Unixmad is a businessman. He needs ROI and it don't look like he's got that after all this time.

The proportion of server upkeep for Zone is already a baseline monthly investment. There is no reason to invest more at this point. Anyone would have cut their losses by now

Key thing to remember is that unixmad is putting real money into this and if he's not getting real money out he ain't gonna wanna put more in!

They need to make the game fun and worthwhile to play, not make it pretty.

That's probably the better way of saying it than my dozens of paragraphs lol

Yea that matters too but I don't see why a tileset revamp wouldn't work in between

they need both. I know quite a few people who I got to try Zone but immediately quit because the tileset literally hurt their eyes. First impressions are everything. The appearance lures people in, but the gameplay gets people to stay.

You are correct. It's just better to retain who we have than lure people in at this stage. Plus, regular, significant updates works too - a lot of people can past a crap appearance to stay. After all, Graal in general is fugly

With that attitude I hope you never become a developer

Let's be serious, I meant the tileset that's almost as old as I am. Not your work <3

Besides, "become"... I think I've had my time. I've got a wife and kids plus work full-time as a developer.

It was fun managing Zone and seeing it get launched though ;)

That was me lol but i just always play zone with brightness on low made me squint

I wish skyworld was changed as a giant space station instead of some random island.

Don't know if this would be possible, but couldn't we use some of the tiles in the Madrox club? The tiles in there look pretty cool to me, and the sky could be replaced with that space backround from mission 9. I think that would look pretty cool.

Again. Don't know if its possible.

I would love dog fighting too :) upgrade / customise your space fighter would be awesome. Would introduce better themed events such as attack/defend battlestation, planet invasion, trade convoy and privateers.

That's a whole extra set of art, code and level design though.

It's a little too flashy imo.

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Can we at least recolor the tile set and make it look like a better shade of blue?

Tone down the thick black outlines whilst at it

Not like it matters, aren't they shutting zone down?

they are NNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNNOOOOOOOOOOOOOTTTTTTT

If you're talking about the thing "that Silver said", that's just a rumor.
I don't see why they would remove it prior to the release of Graal Worlds. It isn't that popular, but it's got more players than most PC servers right now.

Not to advertise my gfx or be egotistic but I just want to show what I mean by adding some more color/shading or just an overall revamp.

http://i.imgur.com/4c2F4jx.png
plz dont hurt me

that looks pretty good Dip.

I like the noob constellation, I think if zone adds a tileset like that there should be some constellations. Pretty cool idea.

waiting for yog or shmegg to come and flame u for advertising lmao

Looks good though <3
good to have u on rosoria

everyone check out my server Piglantis!!!

hey guis i made a new currency,, aint my server the best ..

oooo whats it called?

It's way better than Zone's current tileset and It's more organized than the current map, but you're going through the same problem the Zone tileset creator. Gray+blue. While yours is gray+green.

A while ago I suggested that zone should have different colored areas. So... Let's assume blacky tells me "Hello almighty weeny, can I use ur tile set" and I'll say "sure, but you have to use all the recolors" So basically just assume that I have a bunch more recolors lol

That was the main reason Cassie and I started the Lightworld thing, we would have had 5 different areas each with its own color theme. It was mostly Cassie though, she hated the blue/gray color scheme of Skyworld.

talking about spicing up the tileset but why have greyish roads on a black background?? youve done what zone has except used a different theme lol

I was just using my thing as an example. It's a remake so it shouldn't be all that different. Then again just trying to show an example of a remake

Fair enough, not sure if your screenshot was from the actual server, but if so the tileset could use some more colour. The green is nice, not too eyesore but just enough for that neon/futuristic feel. Maybe try a purple night sky for example?

Also, could you expand on the remake part? As in a remake of zone? Will there be anything unique?

we all do

Just a more eye pleasing tileset thats still keeping zone's concept and theme. Its a basic idea really