Potential Loss of Developing
 

Honestly there's not many developers anymore. Like at all. The ones that haven't quit are either working for the iServers, or the very few playerworlds. Basically the reason there's absolutely no real playerworlds in the making. (other than Maloria)

It's probably due to the fact that most of Graal's large playerbase right now isn't really concerned with developing, as they probably never make it to the Graal forums or any of the web features.

And I know in their website description on the app page (lmfao) they have graalonline.com linked/listed? Buuuuuuuuut it doesn't really work.
https://gyazo.com/5b241de135e1697e7467dee6d11348e2.gif

And there's no real listing of it in game that I can remember. I'm pretty sure there has been in the past.

I mean I personally can't really think of much other than putting it in the FAQ house though. Or in the starting area.

I do feel like the whole of Graal should be introduced more frequently to the newer players though so we can all enjoy Graal in a whole.

Well there's also the out-of-date and downright broken development tools...

kiss me dusty

"potential" as if the Graal boom wasn't back when random ass playerworlds like Doomsday, XOne, Rudora, Faheria, and others existed
when servers like Cynical could launch with a fully-developed overworld and questline and just disappear within 3 months without it being a big deal

from what i experience, nothing much has changed, there are many indevelopment servers right now, but my perception of whos gonna make it somewhere has far changed (objectively speaking)

people have become way too critical and judgemental over the past decade (generally speaking)

the overwhelming amount of games flooding the market makes them struggle to decide what to invest time into without being at loss

the pros to cons of developing with the graal engine arnt really that convincing to me to invest nearly as much time as id like to to stay longtime motivated

A wild "Coco" appears and uses "MLG" to one-shot Downsider,

90% of classic players have no clue what a playerworld is and if they have they probally don't even know how to acess servers off of the list.
It should be advertised and updated as alot of tools are outdated, client still says you need to pay for a gold subscription which confuses newer players.

As for servers many aren't given much motivation to keep on going as client is dead and the chances of going to mobile are 1 in a million plus there is the fact that it takes forever to get approved for such things.
I would blame the death of unholy nations and zodiac for the current state of client as they were the most popular servers and we are now at a huge loss of players.

developers attempt to work on newer servers nowadyas but they never last that long
in general its just management issues and the lack of care given to pc client.

pretty much everyone other than you and your little iClassic clique will still agree it was better back then, would you shut your client-hating mouth for once?
jesus christ this 30 year old will not hop off me tho loweky

yeah but this is a whole new problem, sadly

Not really. Is it a new problem? Sure, but even if they could find their way to development they'd be introduced to all the problems that already existed. Outdated tools, or in some cases no tools at all since W10 is breaking stuff. Poor documentation. Little existing development pool for support. No easily accessible way to actually develop to current standards since you need to pay for a server to do that.

There's a lot wrong, and while Graal has no influx of new developers even if it did they'd encounter problems that imo need to be fixed before trying to get people interested in development.

that's why I said it was a new problem, I totally agree with you

Supporting graal developments needs to be priority or else graal will eventualy be forced to pay devs if they want to keep their iclassic alive.

I'd probably come back if I got paid a decent amount :p

The problem is is that you won't get anywhere from developing on graal except if you do it for fun or learning purposes.
But even then you're better off learning a language like java instead

Because most of the developers we had have grown older and have no interest in working for free anymore and the majority of the new player base from the ios servers are young and have no interest in trying to learn to script/ don't even know about playerworlds.

If the appstore had some kind of basic functional testbed server with ios development tools it may appeal to iserver players more to give it ago, which may result in more aspiring developers.

Sent from my C6603 using Tapatalk

There should honestly be a way to learn developing without getting hired on a server or buying a server like Dusty said. Servers want people who know how to develope, but you can't learn to develope without practicing on a server.
I don't think Unixmad has any intentions of supporting the PC Client or supporting players learning to develope in general. Era has made some attempts to encourage their players to check out the Graal wiki. Hopefully the Testbed server comes back sooner or later so people can learn how to develope.

this is literally what my entire thread stated

Either

a) developers on iPhone stick to iPhone
b) older developers leave graal to do actual coding
c) the developers like alpho and myself who are capable of doing work are blacklisted because of all the ****ery we've done

Because working for a graal server is not worth it. I remember asking an ex scripter of classic how much was she paid, she simply avoided telling me and said she did it mostly for the experience. Left the answer clear enough.

I'd just like to point out the fact that working in a Graal staff team is not something that was meant to be paid for. It's volunteer work, through and through, you're aware of that when you volunteer for it. You do it because you want to do it, not because you need a job.

As for the loss of Developers, this is going to happen as long as PC Client is left to rot. Maybe if you get MD or someone to get off their ass and do their jobs we can turn this around, but otherwise, we're dead in the water and there's nothing else for us to do about it.

Yes, but apparently that volunteer election only applies for GPs and GFXs, I believe scripters, the manager and possibly level/gani maker get paid, I heard. Who knows

You're wrong. That is all.

Yeah. Tricxta is right. Java sucks

How am I wrong?
Gscript is useless
With any other language you atleast have some opportunities to expand to other businesses

Programming is programming. It doesnt really matter which language you learn first as long as you really dig into it and learn the fundamentals that all languages share.

Yeah ofcourse but it still plays a big role since there's different possibilities and limitations, gscript is a waste of time compared to something like C++
Might aswell learn what you can and can not do in a more widely used language.

This.

I owe my career to the years I spent learning GS2.

What is your language of choice these days and what language does your job force on you?

Depends on what I'm doing really. I tend to use the best language for the job, but a lot of what I do is web sites and web services. C# is my language of my choice, but my workplace forces me to use VB.

For webservices do you use perl or python? Lately ive been creating restful apis with python+turbogears

The majority is written in .NET - I tend to use WCF/ASP.NET for web services. I've written a few in node recently to gain exposure to it but it's still fairly new to me :)

I'm not a fan of python. Call me petty but I'm not a fan of the syntax. I'll only use it for quick and dirty crap that I can't pull off easily in Powershell.

Dang I forgot .NET was even a thing. You sound deep into Microsoft land. I cannot relate.

Why does Java sucks? Are not Runescape and Minecraft written with it? And they were good games

RS engine is written with mostly Java, but all of the content they release is designed with RuneScript, which is basically the Runescape equivalent of GraalScript.

Java doesn't necessarily suck, and it all depends on personal preference but the point they are making is somebody who learns GraalScript is not wasting their time as it's still programming and you'll learn a lot of programming fundamentals from it which can be applied to most other languages.

nerds

Java sucks because i have to run multiple versions of jvm to get various apps running at work. I wish people would just decide that java is not a good idea and not develop on it.

I made a full server offline when I had no internet for a year for my sisters to play. I'd look up code snippets online at school and copy other peoples' stuff to learn GraalScript. That's how I got into developing on Graal. Something like that isn't really possible anymore.

ur in our hood now

With Java, and similar OOPLs, I like the strong typing. I don't like the forced verbosity that leads to a cluster**** of monolithic monstrosities because it's cheaper to add methods to an existing class than to create a new one that better fits the scope of the functionality.

In terms of Graal development, it's historically much more productive in the summer because that's when the kids all go on their school vacation and actually have time they can commit on developing for their favorite game. If there aren't many aspiring developers in the pipeline that are earlier in their academic careers, and I highly suspect this to be the case, that's very bad for Graal's present model of player-based development.