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-   -   Understanding "blink" in sparring (https://www.graalians.com/forums/showthread.php?t=35095)

Thallen 04-03-2016 09:48 PM

Understanding "blink" in sparring
 
Every time someone asks me for sparring tips, the first question I ask is, "Do you know anything about blink?" If they're a beginner, I might not even ask that. I'll just tell them that they should run away from their opponent for 2 seconds every time they land a hit or take a hit. That's enough to completely negate any disadvantage they'll experience from not knowing what blink is. It's one of the more complicated mechanics when it comes to sparring.

What is "blink?"
Your blink is the period of invincibility you receive after you take damage (from a sword, bomb, arrow, anything). It's given that name because your character flashes in and out of transparency when you're experiencing this effect. It's a crucial moment in a spar where you can go full-on aggressive or use clever moves to win a trade or juke your opponent.

The maximum length of time that you can maintain your blink is 2 seconds. However, blinking will be canceled early by either of the following:
  1. You change gani from anything other than hurt->idle, hurt->walk, or idle->walk (basically, if you use your sword)
  2. You release your last-held directional key from the moment when you entered the hurt->walk or idle->walk

Breaking Down Cancel #1
The worst thing you can do right after getting hit is wildly swinging your sword again. Any good aggressive sparrer should be able to react quickly enough to combo you, because you immediately lose your blink the moment that you swing your sword.

https://giant.gfycat.com/SpanishNegligibleDachshund.gif
(Click the GIF for a higher-resolution version)

The above clip is a great example of that. You can see that I hit Zeross, juke in front of him then move when he thinks he can get a free hit, wait for him to swing, then I hit him again. I do the same exact move two consecutive times. He falls for it because it looks like it's a free hit while he's in his blink, but better sparrers know how to bait people into canceling their blink to combo them.

Breaking Down Cancel #2
This one is a little tough to understand. When you're hit, you enter the hurt gani. About 1.5 seconds later, if you don't move, you enter the idle gani. The moment you leave the hurt or idle gani, the directional keys that you're pressing (or the buttons you're holding) are extremely important and will determine if you cancel your blink early or not.

Let's say I'm hit in a spar. Right after I'm hit, I start moving straight in the left direction. I can continue going left for 2 full seconds and I'll maintain blink. I can go left+up or left+down. I can strafe in place with left+right and I can even strafe up or down. None of these will cancel my blink early. However, if at any given time I release that left directional key/button, I'll lose my blink.

https://giant.gfycat.com/FemaleIdioticFox.gif
(Click the GIF for a higher-resolution version)

Above, I take a hit. I choose to move straight in the right direction after I'm hit. You can see I continue blinking as I go right and then right+down. The instant that I turn left, I lose my blink. Why? Because to move left, I had to release the right key. You see that I'm well-aware of the situation I'm getting myself into, because I quickly change direction knowing I'll be vulnerable without my blink.

This is the real reason why strafing is good for PC players. If you enter a moving strafe, you're holding down 3 keys. For example, a downwards strafe is left+right+down. You'll be able to maintain your blink letting go any 2 of those keys, as long as you continue to hold down 1 of them. A moving strafe gives you a lot of flexibility with your blink. You can think of cancel #2 like a pivot foot in basketball. A moving strafe essentially gives you 3 feet.

How can I improve my blink mechanics?
I'd recommend starting simple with a basic "J"-shaped technique (like you see in the last GIF). After you're hit, you can run straight at your opponent and curve around them to try to land a hit. The reason you do this is because inexperienced players will try to hit you as you run at them (while in blink), and by curving you're putting yourself in a position to hit them while they're swinging at where you were. When they use their sword, they're in sword.gani for 0.25 seconds and idle.gani for 0.05 seconds before being able to move again.

Here's another clip of me demonstrating that:
https://giant.gfycat.com/WhisperedCe...ngsquirrel.gif
(Click the GIF for a higher-resolution version)

She hits me, I run straight at her, curve, and swing. While a basic technique like that isn't going to work against the best sparrers, it's a good one to know and use against most.

Another good trick, if you're a beginner and sparring against an offensive sparrer, is to simply not move after you're hit. You're guaranteed your full 2 seconds of blink if you do that, and it gives you time to collect yourself and possibly get a free hit on them if they move towards you aggressively.

Here's an example of what I mean:
https://fat.gfycat.com/EvilEnchantingCoelacanth.gif
(Click the GIF for a higher-resolution version)

I don't manage to land a hit in this example, but many sparrers do this as a way of countering combo sparrers. It's a pretty safe move and buys you some time to assess what your opponent is going to do without having to make a move yourself. As blinking can be really difficult for mobile players, this is something that I'd recommend for them.

That's all I'll post for now. Maybe I'll come back to this thread and post useful clips of blink in the future. I'll try to answer any questions. Hope you learned something.

Red 04-03-2016 11:32 PM

Nice thread Thall, will defiantly be trying the J style

Ivy 04-03-2016 11:34 PM

Long distance I need you

Yog 04-03-2016 11:35 PM

Thanks man. This will be extremely helpful.

Kamikaze 04-04-2016 02:03 AM

good job bro I actually didn't know some of that. TY

CM 04-04-2016 02:32 AM

thanks thall. with this thread I was able to win one spar

that's one more spar than I usually win

Areo 04-04-2016 02:35 AM

Isn't blink extended when you freeze?

Of course you can't move so it doesn't really matter.

Thallen 04-04-2016 02:59 AM

Quote:

Posted by Areo (Post 691902)
Isn't blink extended when you freeze?

Of course you can't move so it doesn't really matter.

Yes, your blink is clientside so if you freeze or if you experience a drop in FPS then your blink will be extended longer than the natural 2 seconds. Players who speed hack also experience a shorter blink duration, but that's far outweighed by faster movement speed, sword speed, etc.

Zetectic 04-04-2016 04:04 AM

too perfect to even have a question tbh.
maybe put more examples of u using blink? so it makes it more clear

Brett 04-04-2016 04:42 AM

Will try this on Thallen next time I fight him

Kuz 04-04-2016 02:53 PM

So...Who won you or Zeross?

Zetectic 04-04-2016 03:21 PM

Quote:

Posted by Kuz (Post 692049)
So...Who won you or Zeross?

he did

Thallen 04-04-2016 11:18 PM

Quote:

Posted by Zetectic (Post 691928)
maybe put more examples

I've only been recording spars of mine from the arena for about a week, but here are a few extras. I put them in spoiler tags to reduce page loading times. Explanations are beneath. Click on any clip to see a higher-resolution version.

#1:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/AmazingEnragedBuffalo.gif

You can pinch or pin your opponent between yourself and a wall like this, but it's a rare occurrence. It's something I'd only do if you're comfortable with potentially trading a hit or if you're confident that your opponent doesn't know blink very well. Zeross drops his blink once by slashing upwards while I'm spamming, and I continue spamming because he's pinned down. He could have easily just moved, but he swung again and dropped his blink.


#2:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/FatherlyHelplessBoa.gif

Here's another example of the tip I explained regarding improving your blink mechanics. vEagle hits me, I stand completely still and he gets too close, and I get an easy hit by changing direction and swinging while I've still got blink. He tries to do the same thing, I just stay far from him.


#3:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/GrimyNeedyBooby.gif

Here, Kami and I trade hits and and I notice he drops his blink really early. This is a good example of what I was talking about with strafing. I start going left, but I want to go down to match him. Most players would just go directly down and immediately lose your blink. By strafing downwards, I never actually let go of the left key so I maintain my blink.


#4:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/SleepyUnequaledChameleon.gif

I land a hit on vEagle and I notice he's staying still (as I suggest in one of my beginners' tips). vEagle is one of the better sparrers when it comes to using blink, so I keep a good distance away. I bait his sword out to cancel his blink and move around him for another clean hit.


#5:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/SeriousOddballDorking.gif

This one's slower so you can see the exact moment Kami drops his blink and takes a hit. He gets hit, then moves right+up. You can see him transition to moving the exact opposite way, left+down, which guarantees that he's released his last-held directional key and dropped his blink.


#6:
Spoiler
https://fat.gfycat.com/WatchfulPerfectFurseal.gif

Here's another good example of Kami dropping his blink (sorry for this). After I hit him, he's going left+down. You can see the second he turns and goes right+up, he takes another hit. I go in for another hit and we trade because his blink is canceled when he swings at me.


#7:
Spoiler
https://fat.gfycat.com/SpryTestyJunebug.gif

He does something smarter this time, but it still doesn't work out for him. I hit him, expect him to drop blink and swing again. He sees me swing, turns, and hits me. I've got the blink advantage, so you can see me running straight at him. He realizes I have blink so he tries to run and juke it out of me, but I get a clean hit. This is similar to what I explained in my first post with the "J" technique.


#8:
Spoiler
https://giant.gfycat.com/DamagedSinf...anshepherd.gif

This is a clip to help highlight what 90% of sparrers would claim is lag, delay, cheating, godmode, whatever. We trade hits. I immediately strafe up (left+right+up) held, release the right key to go left, release the left key and go back right, and swing to win a trade hit. The entire time, I've never let go of the up key so I maintain my blink.


If you want to ask a question about any of them, just reference the clip by it's number or quote it.

Zetectic 04-05-2016 01:08 PM

idk why it won't let me rep u. they were all good examples but #8 damn #GodModeMysterySolved

Skyzer 04-05-2016 01:32 PM

I've been waiting so long.

G Fatal 04-05-2016 02:40 PM

Never really been interested in spar as majority of times i played it was just because few from guild were playing and that there was this imaginary delay(not blink) that only ever occurred in battle arena.. Anyways so your saying in short[not exactly had time to read]-that once hit(blink happens) but if you move around for little bit it will keep on blink yet if use sword it will knock you off blink? and basically pc players have better time with this feature?(if they used to pc obz)

MikvaGraal 04-05-2016 04:34 PM

noob's should learn blink though spar experience, if you don't know how to spar using blink take this L like Carolina did last night.(no offense Fulgman)

Thallen 04-05-2016 05:07 PM

Quote:

Posted by G Fatal (Post 692385)
so your saying in short[not exactly had time to read]-that once hit(blink happens) but if you move around for little bit it will keep on blink yet if use sword it will knock you off blink?

You'll continue to blink while moving as long as you never let up on 1 of the directional keys you pressed from the moment you started moving after you take a hit. Swinging your sword also ends your blink.

PC players should find it a lot easier because a keyboard gives you a better feel for that and keyboards also allow you to strafe (holding down 3 keys).

G Fatal 04-05-2016 05:26 PM

Quote:

Posted by Thallen (Post 692403)
You'll continue to blink while moving as long as you never let up on 1 of the directional keys you pressed from the moment you started moving after you take a hit. Swinging your sword also ends your blink.

PC players should find it a lot easier because a keyboard gives you a better feel for that and keyboards also allow you to strafe (holding down 3 keys).

Ah right nice never knew this, well knew about blink but didn't realise it was like that always ended up just swinging sword straight away lol

Thallen 04-06-2016 12:30 AM

Blink probably has very little significance in PKing, but a lot in towering.

When I used to tower often, I was usually designated blocking the door at Sardon's (before the hall and spawn changes). Door blocking is essentially just using your maximum length of blink so that it takes an opponent a full 10 seconds (5 full blink lengths) to kill you a single time. A lot of people claimed that was "chat blocking" or "lag blocking," and that's when I realized that most of the tower community has no idea what blink actually is.

I've been warped and warned for using blink properly at towers several times, even banned for it once (I think). In a game with mechanics as simple as Graal's, I feel like everyone should know what it is.

Quote:

Posted by Zetectic (Post 692375)
they were all good examples but #8 damn #GodModeMysterySolved

I should have used a different clip, because that one is sort of confusing. I don't know what causes it yet, but sometimes the visual effect of your blink ends but your blink itself (the vulnerability) doesn't.

I actually think I'd have still hit him without being hit even if I wasn't blinking, because he swung early and (I believe) only the first frame of your sword registers a hit on iClassic. You might notice sometimes you can walk through someone's sword if you move in after the exact moment they swing. I'll do another guide regarding that sometime. I have a lot of information about hit detection and directional weaknesses that pretty much debunks any "long sword hack" theories.

Kuz 04-06-2016 03:54 AM

Going diagnol increasing blink right?
But strafing and standing still make blink last longer than diagnol right?
And also does strafing make blink last longer than if you were staying still?

Kosiris 04-06-2016 04:09 AM

why is it so that some people can walk through you when they're blinking similar to how you can walk through people in the new version of Sardon's?

Thallen 04-06-2016 04:20 AM

Quote:

Posted by Kuz (Post 692567)
Going diagnol increasing blink right?
But strafing and standing still make blink last longer than diagnol right?
And also does strafing make blink last longer than if you were staying still?

The maximum duration is 2 seconds regardless. If you were to strafe in place or just stand still, you'd get the same duration of blink. The advantage you get out of moving diagonally is that you're technically moving around ~40% faster than cardinally, and you're holding down 2 keys (so you have flexibility in choice of which to release without canceling blink).

Quote:

Posted by Kosiris (Post 692568)
why is it so that some people can walk through you when they're blinking similar to how you can walk through people in the new version of Sardon's?

This is something I was thinking about earlier. I never mentioned the "ghosting" effect in my original post. I don't experience that while using blink in spars, so I think it's something that must only occur in PK zones.

I believe some script that staff added alters this. There are areas of Destiny's tower where you can move through everyone, and then areas where you can't. But, in every PK area, I think you can move through people while you blink. I believe it's for only the first ~0.5 seconds of your blink though, and after that you can't move through players. I don't think it's that way in spars, but I'll have to check to be sure.

Sometimes I'm able to move through my opponent in spars even when I'm not using blink. That's kind of frustrating because I like to circle my opponents a lot and some of that requires nudging up against them. I think it's all caused by glitches that have to do with scripting, probably scripts that are set to trigger once you reach 100 AP or scripts in zones where you don't want players able to block doors.

Neil 04-06-2016 10:21 AM

How often do u use blink to hit people in spar?

Yog 04-06-2016 03:35 PM

Quote:

Posted by Neil (Post 692612)
How often do u use blink to hit people in spar?

Ideally you want to trade on every hit you take.

Thallen 04-06-2016 08:19 PM

Quote:

Posted by Neil (Post 692612)
How often do u use blink to hit people in spar?

Most good sparrers won't let you get away with it, but it's really useful against newer players. More than using blink itself, understanding blink and what causes the cancels is what helps me spar well. I spar very offensively, staying as close as I can and circling opponents. As soon as I see someone change direction or swing their sword to cancel their blink, I know I can hit them and string together a combo. So, just my understanding of blink probably accounts for an average of about 2-3 hits per spar if I had to take a guess.

It's not really something you can force or expect to do every spar, you just have to be conscious and use it when it's there. Some players like Brett and Dante seem to rarely even take advantage of it and they still do really well.

Livid 04-06-2016 10:19 PM

Is there a way to tell if someones going to use blink also, whats the strategy for sparrers that decide to stop moving and wait for you to hit first, they like attack, miss, and wait for you and if you miss they hit you perfectly.

I know how to use blink and I've gone through that business regarding walking through people but this strategy some people use irritate me and always gets me because I expect an intense fight.

Thallen 04-06-2016 11:36 PM

Quote:

Posted by Livid (Post 692802)
Is there a way to tell if someones going to use blink

If someone's trying to use the 2-second blink window to their advantage after they're hit, they'll do one of the following:
  1. Run directly at you, either straight or diagonally, to maintain their blink
  2. Sit completely still and depend on you to move towards them
You can counter the first by just juking or running from them for 2 seconds. You can counter the second by just keeping your distance from them if you recognize them not moving after they've been hit.

Quote:

Posted by Livid (Post 692802)
whats the strategy for sparrers that decide to stop moving and wait for you to hit first, they like attack, miss, and wait for you and if you miss they hit you perfectly

If you're talking about sparrers that refuse to attack you until you've swung at them, there isn't really much counterplay to that. If they're sparring like that, I'd be sure never to double slash or spam. Be sure not to move in an obvious pattern.

This is why a lot of people think delay is OP, because delayers have to spar defensively and they'll rarely be the one making aggressive/risky moves in a spar. It's frustrating and annoying, but unfortunately the more defensive player usually dictates the speed of the spar. I'd just focus on being as precise with your swings as you can and train yourself to never spam your sword against people like this.

Weeno 04-07-2016 01:34 AM

hey thallen can u teach us how to fight the kind of noobs (actual noobs) who run and hit at the same time. Idk how but they manage to hit me a lot and I wanna know how to avoid their lame hits

Relic 04-08-2016 06:03 PM

Just tested your claim that pressing multiple keys at instant of movement (diagonal or strafing) and then letting go of all but one of those keys maintains your blink.. That doesn't seem to work.

I tried diagonal movement and strafing to start my movement and letting go of any keys (but not all of them of course) still cancels blink.

Am I misunderstanding, or is this a case of the blink animation stopping but your blink still staying? I was skeptical when I read that particular point because I've never known or seen that, and when I tested it it didn't seem to work.

edit: in case I'm not being clear...
Quote:

If you enter a moving strafe, you're holding down 3 keys. For example, a downwards strafe is left+right+down. You'll be able to maintain your blink letting go any 2 of those keys, as long as you continue to hold down 1 of them.

Thallen 04-08-2016 10:28 PM

Quote:

Posted by Weeno (Post 692889)
hey thallen can u teach us how to fight the kind of noobs (actual noobs) who run and hit at the same time

Those are probably the easiest people to spar. They'll chase you all around the arena. Just bait them into following you, come to a stop so they think they can get a free hit, and then turn 90° and hit them from the side as they swing at you.

Quote:

Posted by Relic (Post 693419)
Just tested your claim that pressing multiple keys at instant of movement (diagonal or strafing) and then letting go of all but one of those keys maintains your blink... That doesn't seem to work.

I tried diagonal movement and strafing to start my movement and letting go of any keys (but not all of them of course) still cancels blink.

Am I misunderstanding, or is this a case of the blink animation stopping but your blink still staying? I was skeptical when I read that particular point because I've never known or seen that, and when I tested it it didn't seem to work.

I just rewatched the video I recorded while testing everything from my original post, and it looks like I may have possibly pressed 1 key earlier than the other 2 when doing the strafe test (instead of all 3 at once).

I just tested it several more times and it actually seems like, if you begin to strafe immediately after you take a hit, releasing even 1 key cancels your blink. For example, strafing downwards (left+right+up) and then changing to diagonal (right+up) cancels blink. I thought then that maybe Graal can only support two "blink keys," so I tried it in several different directions. I got the same results every time, so I'm doubting it's that.

So, it seems to be that strafing is actually really bad. Due to the way Graal is coded, all directions (when moving) overwrite "up" and "right". I don't know if that's what's causing it and Graal is trying to only assign two keys to control your blink when you strafe or what. It's a strict disadvantage, because it's dropping your blink even when you release 1 key of the 3. I even tried starting my blink by moving up, then strafing (up+left+right), then going back to just up (which means I never released my original single key), and it canceled my blink. A strafe seems to actually be an animation cancel in itself as soon as you leave it.

In example #8 that I showed in reply to Zetectic, I mentioned:
Quote:

Posted by Thallen (Post 692500)
I actually think I'd have still hit him without being hit even if I wasn't blinking, because he swung early and (I believe) only the first frame of your sword registers a hit on iClassic.

It seems that this was the case. Also worth noting is that there are 2 animation frames to your blink: 1 where your character is completely visible and normal and 1 where it's transparent. That's what I was referring to in this comment:
Quote:

Posted by Thallen (Post 692500)
I should have used a different clip, because that one is sort of confusing. I don't know what causes it yet, but sometimes the visual effect of your blink ends but your blink itself (the vulnerability) doesn't.

It gets a bit confusing if you end your blink when you're already in the visible animation frame, as it looks like it was ended earlier.

I'll do more proper testing when I've got the time. Let me know (anyone) if anyone discovers anything else strange about cancel #2. It deals with stuff like directional weaknesses and it gets really weird. Until then, I'd advise everyone to avoid strafing while blinking unless you intend to end your blink in that strafe. I rarely do it myself because it feels a little clunky and unnatural, but I'll definitely avoid doing it after noticing this. I'll edit my original post shortly to include strafing as a third cancel and I'll credit you as helping pinpoint that.

Kuz 04-08-2016 10:40 PM

Ahaa Neat guide on blink overall...have you considered doing other guides for the other aspect of sparring e.g. hitboxes, different sparring techniques etc.

Thallen 04-08-2016 11:05 PM

Quote:

Posted by Kuz (Post 693586)
have you considered doing other guides for the other aspect of sparring e.g. hitboxes, different sparring techniques etc.

I will eventually, it's probably important for people to realize stuff like this:
https://giant.gfycat.com/BowedImpass...pbackwhale.gif

There's a bunch of safe corners and other weird things relating to hit detection. I'll end up doing more guides when I find the time.

Winter 04-09-2016 04:05 AM

^ If you want an example of this, I tend to use specific angles like these quite a lot.. The secret is out :'(

Skyzer 04-09-2016 05:29 AM

Quote:

Posted by Thallen (Post 693577)
So, it seems to be that strafing is actually really bad. Due to the way Graal is coded, all directions (when moving) overwrite "up" and "right". I don't know if that's what's causing it and Graal is trying to only assign two keys to control your blink when you strafe or what. It's a strict disadvantage, because it's dropping your blink even when you release 1 key of the 3.

That's pretty much what happens. Graal doesn't check to see if more than one key is pressed at a time, so each key will still give individual inputs.

Nanner 04-09-2016 05:12 PM

Would rep but I need to spread first :/ very helpful tho cuz I never knew this and I'm tryna become better so gg

Thallen 06-17-2016 11:57 PM

I can no longer edit the OP so I corrected and moved this information here: http://danclestine.weebly.com/learning-to-blink.html

That URL will probably change, because I'll pay for a Weebly package and change domains eventually. If it ever stops working, just go to http://clandestine.pw/ and navigate through to Strategy -> Sparring -> Learning to Blink.


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