More loot-buying NPCs (and other loot stuff)
 

As we all know, there are a number of NPCs in Classic that will buy different types of loot for double what you'd get from Elster (the guy that buys it all). I think more loot should be sellable to NPCs throughout the map. Example: There should be an NPC that buys jewellery-related loot (gold necklace, gold nugget, all the different pearls). Obviously the railroad shop salesman should buy draisine wheels. The blacksmith should by the disabled nukes. The chapel priest should buy the fake graals. Taylor Richards should buy the boots. Any of the various hat shop owners could buy the zorbi helm. I could go on and on, but you get the idea.

I also think that rare loot should sell for more (and that an NPC other than half-price Elster should buy it). The old gnome in the hidden underground cave shop buys those gems for 150. Why not have him buy the rare "magical" items? Also, the price of said loot should at least be doubled. Currently, no one actually sells the rare loot because it's just not worth it.

Making these changes/additions might help make diving for loot an actual viable way to make money. Also, I think it's about time some new loot is added (including new furniture and/or hats, maybe a rare water pet?).

Yes.
I was pretty disappointed when I found out all the gold stuff, pearls, crystals, etc didnt go to anyone specific for a higher sell price.

I had originally planned for much more to be able to be sold but I put them on the back burner to get the railroads finished.

Honestly I don't quite know anyone in particular I'd want the rarer stuff to be sold to. The "gnome" has nothing to do with the magical items. If players have suggestions as to what NPCs could buy what you can post them here and I will take it into consideration.

The draisine wheels were supposed to be sold to the shopkeep in the railroad station. I must have forgot or it's bugged up.

I feel like this would be cooler if there was a more fleshed out character system. Instead of selling broken drasine wheels to the ticket counter people at the Railroad Station, it would be better to say sell it to somebody living in a random house who gets commissioned to build drasines for the different shops. You could really pair up any of the loot with any number of characters in the game (I found a list of loot here) but it honestly just doesn't make a whole lot of sense to me for all the NPCs to have unlimited pockets of cash to buy broken versions of crap they are remotely associated with.

Well, typically the people who buy loot don't buy loot simply out of association. The guy at the railroad station would buy the draisine wheel because they sell draisines, and thus, can repurpose/refurbish the wheel.

I don't really feel like adding NPCs solely to buy loot would really be something I'd like to do.

Just an idea to throw out there for the magical items, the witch in onnet forest. She doesn't play much of a role after you get the rat morph, and that way the forest maze thing would be used more

I know you would prefer not to add new npcs BUT... what about a troll under a bridge who associates with the black market selling these rare goods to far away lands.
-> http://dustyshouri.dreamhosters.com/.../noobsig_5.png

I would think the pyrat would at least want the pearls and the golden items (nuggets, necklaces). Sorta makes sense.

Yeah that was my original thought as well. I was surprised when I first tried to sell him these items and was unsuccessful.

Also, in addition to some of my ideas in the original post, here's some more loot that could be logically sold to these respective NPCs:

The NPC in Oasis who collects shells should also buy the crab shell (it has the word "shell" in it, for god sake!)

The Blacksmith should additionally buy the broken key and broken goggles (perhaps the other blacksmith, the one in York Town, could buy these ones)

One of the NPCs at Brothers' soccer shop should buy the deflated soccer ball.

The bartender that buys mugs should also buy the bottles/broken bottles (or perhaps another bartender could).

I kind of like the idea of adding an NPC who buys the rare loot for the black market, or to use the witch in Onnet Forest. Perhaps she could use the rare once-magical items as reagents for potions or something.

*a pyrat would steal it from u, not buy it from you. its why they made a quest for them. to kill them for money,kills, bombs, arrows, accidental player kills, and stuff. why would a pyrat buy something if they can steal it from you.

There's a business-pyrat. He's not like the others.

Maybe the "Queen of Graal" NPC in the jail could buy the pearls and gold items? She seems the type

It would be cool if you could sell loot items to associated NPCs, and that would enable you to buy a new item that only lasts for a limited time. For example you sell the deflated soccer ball to one of the brothers, and you would be able to purchase a patched ball, which only lasts so long, before you need it patched again (buy another patched ball). Or you could buy a repaired drasine that needs to be 'rerepaired' (buy another repaired drasine) every so often.

Or instead of unlocking a new buy item, you swap the deflated ball for a patched ball and pay a few gralats on top with the associated npc. I think this would be a really nice idea though and give a lot of nps a better feeling of purpose making the game feel that much more complete in player's eyes.

I'm sure almost every player has been wondering if that blacksmith in snowtown will ever forge them some nice doodad.

Make the witch that gives the rat morph buy the magic stuff?

Eh I say we get all the loot-needy npc's in one room and make our lives easier by just selling loot for full price instead of cheap Elster.
You know what I say we rob Elster! Like how does he exhsnge us money if he lives in a cave! Since when hobos became rich! I demand freedom of full price loot! I had a dream in which graalians could live in a fair looting exchange! And ever since then my destiny was to fulfill that dream. SAVE THE CHILDREN!

money is allowed in jail?!omg.
the guy above me(not the one with the quote thingy)the one who stole martin luther kings speach,he bored me to death.

he would probably get the item and run away,but leave behind something like part of a quest.


STORY TIME!
Selling of golden stuff;part one:I was playing graalclassic one day,while i saw this old lady in jail that i had recently gotten a shirt from.she got in jail for impersonating a princess,which is true.


i Went to my car in real life and drove to the nearest jail.i asked to see the impersonator of a princess,and showed me a black woman with black hair,and a beard.she said,"what the hell do you want u ass?".I replied,"I saw u on a video game,dont u remember me?She replied,"go to hell u computer loving geek no life."The police were weirded out that i played a game and met them in real life,so they threw me out for being a ********.

After the weird experience,i went back to playing graal,and found the old princess impersonator,in jail.she didnt say anything i could remember and didnt cuss at me.what a miracle video games are to real llife.i talked to her and said quietly,"will u buy my gold nuggets i found in a dirty old swamp i didnt wash?".she replied,"omg get the f*** away from me u gold bootlegger. i cant even afford 59 pounds of gold.

and so,she bought 1 pound of gold from me, it was the happiest day of my life.after the trade,i was chased by cops,for illegally going to jail and trading items for money.i was caught and put in jail. before i got caught,i went to the bank and put my money in a bank account,and im now in jail sitting next to a old imposter princess. the end.


sorry for bad spelling,grammar,punctuation,or something.

Soo.. Can we expect to see any more loot-buying NPCs anytime soon? As we all know, some new loot was just recently added. Would be a good time to let us sell more of our loot (for what the loot is actually worth).

I'm sitting on about 500 pieces of loot because I have no intention on selling it to Elster for half-price. Dusty, you said the Draisine salesman was supposed to buy draisine wheels, but he still doesn't. I think some good ideas have been pitched in this thread, as well. It would just be nice to see looting actually become an efficient way to make money.

Sorry, but sometimes I browse/reply on the forums while I'm not online and it can be hard to remember. It is done though.

I've kept track of the money various "jobs" make, looting is actually a pretty viable method of making money. If it wasn't I would buff it, and it was buffed many times in the first month it was released.

In my opinion all jobs should be balanced and pay out the same... job variety should be there for just that: variety. Players shouldn't have to force themselves to do a job that's boring because it pays better. I feel it's a better more enjoyable game if players can pick how they want to make money without feeling ripped off. So I balanced looting with bug catching to the best I could manage.

Do you make the same amount of money from looting/bug catching as you do farming?

i think horse farming and bug catching are somewhat similar, but looting is lagging behind. It needs a higher spawn rate(i sell in bundle, so idk if its much beter selling individually)

The issue is looting was released in the winter and so was balanced when bug catching was off-season. It was actually more profitable to loot in fall/winter than it was to bug catch. However, I severely underestimated how profitable bug catching was in-season so things may need to be reevaluated.

Also looting spawn rates are already pretty high as long as play by its rules. Idling in one area waiting is the slowest way to actually loot.

kind of off topic, what exactly do the swimming goggles do and how do I use them, it says not useable in water, and using them on land does nothing. I have noticed no different spawn rate (Maybe I'm just stupid) only some new items (Maybe, like the deactivated nuke.)

It's a passive item. Having it increases spawn rate while you are underwater(under the logic that you are able to see better). You don't have to use it or have it equipped. I'll try to make it a bit more clear since Classic doesn't really have a passive inventory like Zelda does.

Wow, I honestly didn't know that. I mean, I knew they increased loot spawn rate, but I didn't know you had to be under water for it to kick in. :shock:

And I'm glad you're re-evaluating looting. I honestly think a few more loot-buying NPCs will solve the problem. That way if people want to put in the effort to get the most out of their loot, they can. If people just want to sell it all to half-price Elster, they can do that too.

I think perhaps a few of the loot values should be increased too. Especially the rare ones. Yes, they're fun to display, but I have more than one of most of them. And i just can't see selling them for that little (even if I did get the full 150 gralat value, it's still not enough). I must have looted close to 1000 times before finding one odd-shaped gem. I wouldn't sell it for anything less than 1k.

Finding these rare loot items should be an awesome moment. But given the value of these items, it's hard to feel like I've found anything that special (especially since 1 bumblebee, not even on bee day, is worth more than what you can get from selling most of the rare loot items. Think about that)

Right now the issue is that I track what loot is SOLD, not what loot is found. I will track the value of loot found for a bit and see what it's "projected" income is, as a lot of players apparently hoard loot.

It's also hard because these things need to be monitored over time to get a good sort of "average" as some days may not have a lot of players looting vs another day where everyone is looting for example. So all changes related to loot income is a slow, heavily monitored process.

well I was a bit confused and angry when selling 49 loot items got me 500 gralats. Thank you for clarifying how to utilize the goggles, so go underwater and tap the icon?

No, the goggles are passive. Meaning you don't have to use or even equip them. Basically, if you dive under water while swimming around looking for loot, you'll see more loot spawn points. I tried it myself and it does actually work.

Edit - Upon further testing, I actually don't think there is any difference. Regardless, I always assumed the goggles just worked passively by increasing loot spawn rate (and not having to go under water to make them work), and I thought that I was seeing more spawn points since I got the goggles, but it could very well be a "placebo effect" of sorts. I would like more clarification on exactly how these goggles work. Dusty?

i see no difference.
also,i think the loot prices are just fine.if u wanted to raise it,it would be 40 gralats a piece.:unsure:

I think you're right (about the goggles). I edited my previous post.

And, again, I don't think the loot prices necessarily need to be raised (except for some of the rare loot), i just think there needs to be more NPCs scattered throughout the map that pay the full price for loot. As you know, most of the loot can only be sold to Elster (the hoarder) for half-price. But if you can't sell that loot anywhere else, then it's not really half-price. It's just what the loot is worth. And the numbers are too low when compared to other methods of making gralats. But Dusty already said that the loot numbers may be a little off given how they originally evaluated the system, so we'll see what happens.

I pretty much clarified it a few posts up:

No, I know. But based on testing, it doesn't seem to work that way at all. Even so, being under water while searching for loot just slows me down. And given that the way to loot is to move from area to area. I see way more loot spawn buy just swimming down the various canals. Going under water doesn't seem to yield more spawn points in any way. Perhaps the goggles need to be tweaked in some way?

I'd encourage you to test this for yourself, as I'm definitely not seeing increased loot spawn points whilst swimming under water.

It's not going to make stuff suddenly appear, and it's not going to yield double the spawn rate either if that's what you're expecting. Spawn rates depend on a host of factors, the goggle bonus gives it a slight boost.

I don't really need to test it because I'm looking right at the code that determines spawn rates.

I actually seem to find loot spawn close to me in the direction I am facing while under water.

Things that determine the rate of loot spawning:
1) Whether you are diving and have the goggles.
2) Areas with a lot of water lowers the chance slightly(such as sitting in the York Town Bay)
3) Having already obtained an item in that surrounding area slightly decreases the rate
4) Being in a new area increases the rate
5) Spawn spots already existing decreases the rate slightly
6) The more to items you have found in a specific area, the less likely you are to find more items in that area.

All in all, diving was designed to encourage movement, and it was designed to punish those who sat in one spot looting over and over. To increase your chances the best thing you can do is create a route in which you loot a specific area for a little while, then move on to the next area and repeat.

What about vip island?theres a ****load of loot and water

Well they paid 7500 gralats for VIP, since VIP is actually useless, I guess they found a way to make it more profitable.

Actually, VIP island is arguably the best place for both looting and bug catching (for agrias and blue morpho butterflies, anyway).

Though I do kind of wish they'd add some content to all those buildings that seem to serve no purpose.

Ok just want to clear this up for the billionth time. Thanks for bearing with us players, as we are not looking right at the code :)
Relating to your post's numbered bullet points, I have these questions:

1.) Having the goggles, as well as 'diving' and swimming underwater increases spawn rate? (I would ask by how much, but I feel that's pushing it)

2.) Does the spawn rate get applied to each tile of water? For example, on average would one expect to find more loot in york bay after looting for an hour, or would they get more loot from swimming in the pond by stefan's house? Just unclear how the spawn rate is applied.

3.) Is this decrease in rate relative to the current play session, a certain amount of time, or the character's overall looting 'history?'

4.) Traveling seems to halt spawns altogether - does moving to a different map/level determine a new 'area' or is it indicated by bodies of water? Or is the intended effect that while you are moving the chance of a loot spawn is increased?

5.) I have never seen more than 2 loot dots at one time present on the screen, and that, very rarely. Do the loot dots spawn independently of each other, and, if so, is it possible to get more than 2 to appear at a time?

6.) Is this the same statement as #3, or more so to say that this effect gets applied cumulatively for every item you manage to loot in a specific area?


Also - do the loot related hats have any effect on loot spawns? The zorbi hat and the new Narwhal horn?

Thanks again!

I'm curious about this as well

Here are some things i can answer a little about.

1. I am not aware of anything about this question,but it is probably enabled once you gain the item,but its my guess.

2.I think that there is a area of which is around you that follows you everywhere and if your near the area that senses water it makes a dot.The area might be the range that you can see.

3.JVKEKEKVEFKFEKGEKF NOONONONONONNOIDKDKDKDKDK

4.-^^im pretty sure you get the same amount of loot either way,if it gets more loot i guess that it gets loot based off of the player and area of water.
5.Possibility may be that it wont let you have more than two dots,but i cant tell u since im not much of a diver anymore.

7. The hats don't do anything special,u just wear them.

so if I understand right you are tracking how much of each loot was sold, are you going to change the selling prices of a specific loot if this one won't be sold like supply and demand?

I'm not sure how I'll balance it yet.

I didn't take the time to read all the thread comments but in case it wasn't already said, i believe the NPC "Jack the pyrat" should take gold, normal and black pearls, as well as gold nuggets. I find it odd that he takes helms and anchors, yet he doesn't take ACTUAL treasure aside from doubloons. Just food for thought.

Gold nuggets are taken by the miner in the caves, near where you get
the mine worker's hard hat.

Whaaat?

Where is this? I got the miner's hat years ago, so hell if I remember. Wasn't it from the old secret cave you had to bomb open north of Graal city that's long gone?

*Immediately goes onto Graal to search*

Edit - I knew I wasn't going to find anything. But I wanted to believe. :(

just trying to get some interest in the loot selling... that's the way it should be, anyway...

And as for the miner hat, I believe that he was stuck on a little island of ground in a big empty expanse somewhere deep in the railroad tunnels...

Or maybe when your in onnet an u get in first cave to head east to snowtown as soon as u enter miner is right there :)

He got killed by falling rocks

I was talking about the old railroad layout... :)