Posted by MrSimons

This is exactly why there are a lot of people who do not like the USMC. Regardless of the cause, anyone who has so little value for human life is a sack of ****.

People despise the Marines and most love em'. Regardless, we are there to protect the right for them to do so.

ISIS brings terror wherever they go. I hear damn near every new story that comes out. I want to go out there out of anger and sense of duty, not bloodlust.

Posted by MrSimons

Yes they are; their actions are obviously inhumane and atrocious, but I fail to see how hoping you get a chance to kill people is humane either. The middle east is a ****ed up place right now, and a lot of the terrorists that are out there are people whose choices were to support ISIS or die.

I get what you are saying. I know its a lose-lose scenario really. But isn't okay to let them keep growing, and just because they are forced to kill people it doesn't make it okay.  

Posted by Kendama

People despise the Marines and most love em'. Regardless, we are there to protect the right for them to do so.

ISIS brings terror wherever they go. I hear damn near every new story that comes out. I want to go out there out of anger and sense of duty, not bloodlust.


I get what you are saying. I know its a lose-lose scenario really. But isn't okay to let them keep growing, and just because they are forced to kill people it doesn't make it okay.

I agree completely with you, ISIS is something that needs to be removed from the world, and I myself have a lot of respect for the US Armed Forces. But "I hope I get lucky enough to put some of them down in the next couple years." is not okay.  

Posted by Kendama

You're argument is pointless. There is a sea of difference between ISIS and the Confederacy. Trying to bring something as evil as ISIS to assist your argument is ridiculous.

Your argument is pointless because you claim people should be free to express themselves by flying whatever flag they want yet clearly contradict yourself.

Posted by MrSimons

This is exactly why there are a lot of people who do not like the USMC. Regardless of the cause, anyone who has so little value for human life is a sack of ****.

I have no sympathy for anything that happens to anyone who supports ISIS. I feel like everyone has a mental line that, once crossed by someone, completely dehumanizes the person. It's almost as if they revoke the right to be treated under the protection of laws.  

So this thread went from Apple and a flag to terrorism and ISIS. God bless Graalians.  

I encourage everyone to watch this video.
http://thedailyshow.cc.com/videos/4yoaqb/flagdance  

Posted by Sariss

So this thread went from Apple and a flag to terrorism and ISIS. God bless Graalians.

Mostly about flags though so...  

why would they ban the amerrycan flag?  

This is a wall of text but I was addressing multiple people. Either way, I feel like I have a lot to say.

Posted by Crono

Your argument is pointless because you claim people should be free to express themselves by flying whatever flag they want yet clearly contradict yourself.



I have no sympathy for anything that happens to anyone who supports ISIS. I feel like everyone has a mental line that, once crossed by someone, completely dehumanizes the person. It's almost as if they revoke the right to be treated under the protection of laws.

It seems utterly obvious that you will go to farther than normal lengths to try to argue any point against me that you feel you can. I encourage debate, but you put yourself in a silly and incomparable position- and your grudge against me for some reason takes away from the normal ability to converse with actual facts.

They are two different situations that cannot be compared, I stand behind everything American, so that is what I am relaying as acceptable. While we have a freedom of expression, supporting a federally declared enemy flag (in a way that is supporting an enemy) can and has been declared treason and that can mean a death sentence.

Spoiler

According to the United States Constitution, Article III, § 3, “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.”

Under federal statute, a person guilty of treason against the United States “shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.” 18 U.S.C. § 2381.

Now you can bet your ass that the same thing was in effect during the civil war. People of the Union would be considered traitors to the union if they sported the Confederate flag. The Confederacy was a declared enemy of the state. That is war, and war will bend constitutional rights.

That said, we are not at war with the Confederacy of 1861. Wearing a Confederate flag does not imply that person is at war with the US. It has been a regional symbol and a symbol of Southern heritage. Additionally, it has also been a symbol of racism. It really depends on the person and how cool they are.

With everything said, it is dangerous and an immediate threat to the United States to wear the ISIS flag during this time of war. There are things that bend our constitutional rights and usually those things involve danger and war. They are there for good measures as I just proved.

If the Confederate flag can be proved as an act of rebellion, it could be ruled by the Supreme Court to be threatening and it would be outlawed. The thing is, that is not going to happen despite how many people in the north want it to happen.

While there are laws that protect against hate crime and public discrimination (especially in the workforce), there is no law to prevent someone from expressing that they do not like black people. What reason could the courts have to outlaw the Confederate flag, in that regard? Even if they can prove it represents a racist history, racism itself is not illegal. It would have to be a legitimate threat. In order for that they would have to tie it into a group or movement, most likely the church burnings (hate crimes). The percentage of people who use the flag and engage in this activity is incredibly low.

That is the difference between being able to represent a controversial flag under the Constitutional right, freedom of expression and speech, and supporting a flag of an officially declared enemy/hostile group.

Posted by MrSimons

I agree completely with you, ISIS is something that needs to be removed from the world, and I myself have a lot of respect for the US Armed Forces. But "I hope I get lucky enough to put some of them down in the next couple years." is not okay.

I respect your philosophy and I understand why people feel this way. If everyone in the world feels that way humanity could have no bounds. But I feel more blunt about the matter. If people are out there with the moral consciousness to torture innocents (nonetheless women and children... and civilians) and execute them, bring them into slavery, and declare other cultures and beliefs as evil and "must be destroyed"...

Well I want to be the one the hunt them down. I don't want to be on the sidelines watching the news saying "Oh those poor people! ISIS is so evil. I hope something happens about this.". I want to be there to get rid of it.
ISIS is cancer to the Earth. It isn't just a country at war with another country, ISIS has declared war on the world rejecting reason and tossing aside compassion and cannot even work together with any other group on the Earth. They lack any ability to cooperate even with OTHER terror groups. They have no place, and I have no doubts about what needs to happen to them.

I do sympathize the young souls who have been forced into ISIS and brainwashed. But they made up their minds despite it not being a fair choice, and they are too much of a liability to the world. They haven't showed the world mercy, and showing mercy back would be unfair to all those who have been slaughtered.

Sorry for my long post, I enjoy hearing what other kids my age think about this from different parts of the world and lifestyles. I spend most of my social time these days around Marines, Marine Poolees, and Southern Republicans. It obviously effects my viewpoint when compared to others, I keep an open eye and envy some philosophies but I still believe in the to-the-point and firm methods I have grown up with.  

Posted by Kendama

This is a wall of text but I was addressing multiple people. Either way, I feel like I have a lot to say.


It seems utterly obvious that you will go to farther than normal lengths to try to argue any point against me that you feel you can. I encourage debate, but you put yourself in a silly and incomparable position- and your grudge against me for some reason takes away from the normal ability to converse with actual facts.

They are two different situations that cannot be compared, I stand behind everything American, so that is what I am relaying as acceptable. While we have a freedom of expression, supporting a federally declared enemy flag (in a way that is supporting an enemy) can and has been declared treason and that can mean a death sentence.

Spoiler

According to the United States Constitution, Article III, § 3, “Treason against the United States, shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering to their Enemies, giving them Aid and Comfort. No Person shall be convicted of Treason unless on the Testimony of two Witnesses to the same overt Act, or on Confession in open Court.”

Under federal statute, a person guilty of treason against the United States “shall suffer death, or shall be imprisoned not less than five years and fined under this title but not less than $10,000; and shall be incapable of holding any office under the United States.” 18 U.S.C. § 2381.

Now you can bet your ass that the same thing was in effect during the civil war. People of the Union would be considered traitors to the union if they sported the Confederate flag. The Confederacy was a declared enemy of the state. That is war, and war will bend constitutional rights.

That said, we are not at war with the Confederacy of 1861. Wearing a Confederate flag does not imply that person is at war with the US. It has been a regional symbol and a symbol of Southern heritage. Additionally, it has also been a symbol of racism. It really depends on the person and how cool they are.

With everything said, it is dangerous and an immediate threat to the United States to wear the ISIS flag during this time of war. There are things that bend our constitutional rights and usually those things involve danger and war. They are there for good measures as I just proved.

If the Confederate flag can be proved as an act of rebellion, it could be ruled by the Supreme Court to be threatening and it would be outlawed. The thing is, that is not going to happen despite how many people in the north want it to happen.

While there are laws that protect against hate crime and public discrimination (especially in the workforce), there is no law to prevent someone from expressing that they do not like black people. What reason could the courts have to outlaw the Confederate flag, in that regard? Even if they can prove it represents a racist history, racism itself is not illegal. It would have to be a legitimate threat. In order for that they would have to tie it into a group or movement, most likely the church burnings (hate crimes). The percentage of people who use the flag and engage in this activity is incredibly low.

That is the difference between being able to represent a controversial flag under the Constitutional right, freedom of expression and speech, and supporting a flag of an officially declared enemy/hostile group.

Yeah, no...the last time anyone was convincted of treason in the US was in 1949 for collaborating with the Third Reich. You're not going to be convicted for treason for flying the flag. Your attempt to quote something official completely flopped as well because "adhering to their enemy" literally has nothing to do with flags.

My point is that I've seen a lot of people like you claim to respect freedom of expression regarding the confederate flag yet most of you are also the type that would question the presence of things like:

http://www.warstore.co.uk/ekmps/shops/marlina/images/german-ww2-regular-nazi-5-x-3-flag-1493-p.jpg (Unsupported image host)  

All these organizations are responsible for some of the worst crimes against humanity, why even bother comparing them?

Seriously, the amount of hypocrisy in this thread is reaching embarrassing levels.  

omg i support Isis and abortions and Nazi's and the Conferdate Flag im cool
fuck all of you  

Subscribed to this thread <3  

Posted by Crono

Yeah, no...the last time anyone was convincted of treason in the US was in 1949 for collaborating with the Third Reich. You're not going to be convicted for treason for flying the flag. Your attempt to quote something official completely flopped as well because "adhering to their enemy" literally has nothing to do with flags.

My point is that I've seen a lot of people like you claim to respect freedom of expression regarding the confederate flag yet most of you are also the type that would question the presence of things like:

Yea dude, Nazi flags are great, everyone has the right to own one obvss. How would it be free speech if I can't own a Nazi flag and fly it over my home, car, and workplace. Its like oppression to not be allowed to have a Nazi flag, they have nothing to do with the holocaust or Germany attempting to become a world wide empire; its just a symbol of how Germany brought itself up from nothing after the first world war.  

So many historians in the Graalian community :0  

Posted by MrSimons

Yea dude, Nazi flags are great, everyone has the right to own one obvss. How would it be free speech if I can't own a Nazi flag and fly it over my home, car, and workplace. Its like oppression to not be allowed to have a Nazi flag, they have nothing to do with the holocaust or Germany attempting to become a world wide empire; its just a symbol of how Germany brought itself up from nothing after the first world war.

I don't understand how people are missing my actual point.